‘99 Move Engine Rebuild

[spitfireza7]

Hi Folks

First post, happy to have joined the forum

I bought a ‘99 Move non-runner in South-Africa. Paid too much, but it had good bodywork and valid papers - hard to find!

The vision is to have a fun, quirky, small and light on fuel run around. The SUV is a bit heavy on cost per km. Roughly 150K kilometers on the dial and showing wear in all the common places.

I’ve taken out the engine and gearbox and cleaned all the parts I could in the ultrasonic. As I was cleaning and gathering information on where to source parts, it turns out its quite difficult this side of the world (and pretty sure around the globe)!

Many hours spent phoning, scouring classifieds, and messaging part-stores. I then get recommended to a guy that is an independent daihatsu dealer - i phone him up and “wow! The search is over! He has parts!”.

He said that has he 7 of these ED20 engines at home and will charge me for the full head (high, but reasonable). Then he continues and asks if I am rebuilding. I say, yes and proceed to tell the quick backstory. He promptly replied and said “Don’t do it yourself, you will F*** it up. It will bite you. I will charge you 3 hours labour to rebuild it”. I asked for any specifics and he just said that everything on the engine is complicated and it will bite.

I respectfully agree and say that he is the expert, but upon phoning again to find out how to proceed, he says that I must give him all my cars engine parts with ZAR 12000.00 and he will then give me a running engine.

Look, Everyone must eat; I understand that. I am not one to badmouth anyone. Considering no specifics mentioned and not being allowed to see the parts upfront, I just don’t know if this is the type of person I want to do business with.

So I want to ask the community here what are the specifics that I need to take into account (other than whats in the manual and using common sense during disassembly and assembly) when rebuilding this engine?

[Butch_Butcher]

Welcome aboard.
To answer all of your questions, you will be required by this forum’s staff to start a separate thread on this topic. Perhaps, it would be best to do it in diary form?

[evilhighway]

Yes as Butch_Butcher said Please make an introduction post (New thread) post in the “All New People” section and tell us a little about yourself and your move. Include a pic if you can.

As for your question on the engine build with out knowing your previous experience level with engines and cars it is hard to guage.
That being said an ed20 is a really easy build with the block in comparison to some engine’s.
For this person to say it everything will bit you is a bit of a stretch.
$12000.00 is about $1000 AUD and that is not unreasonable here at all for a rebuilt engine even a changeover. However if this is a private sale you have not viewed the engine running or any details on it, then I would advise caution as you would not know.
Rebuilding your own engine will teach you how to by doing but do some basic engine build reseach before and as you go.

[Butch_Butcher]

[quote=“evilhighway, post:3, topic:6883”]…ed20 is a really easy build…[/quote]Having looked up 1999 MOVEs: 1999 daihatsu move at DuckDuckGo , both first generation and second generation models are to be seen, assuming this was a transition year. If so, he might have an EJ in his, depending on how far in the model year his was manufatured in

[evilhighway]

Considering he speaks of ed20’s in his post. My reply was based on that but yes you may be correct and also I have no idea what was delivered to South Africa.

[Butch_Butcher]

There are several unanswered questions. Firstly, was there an attempt at getting the engine to run? From what was to understand, the engine was quickly condemned to rebuild, before any tests were conducted whatsoever. Thereafter, only telephone contact with a supposed “dealer” was made who likely assumed an ED was in there, without confirming this himself.
In any event, if the thread’s author was capable of removing the drivetrain and then disassembling it for cleansing, and if it turns out genuinely to be an ED, an ED is simple enough to rebuild himself, under guidance from us, upon request

[spitfireza7]

Thank you for the replies and support - sorry, I just have not had time to get back to you all.

I promise to give a comprehensive reply by tomorrow.

Just as a quick update, I measured the subassembly and so far so good - straight forward - no alarms. Crank is in spec and seems to only need a polish, the rod housing and sleeves all measure to spec while also still showing its cross hatching.

I am picking up new pistons, rings, clutch and bearings tomorrow. I will have to order thrust washers as they don’t seem to be in stock here in ZA.

More updates to follow tomorrow -

[spitfireza7]

Okay - finally some time to get back to you! I will be sure to post an introduction on the thread as advised and add some pictures.

Yes, so this engine is definitely an ED20, not the EJ (which would have been easier to find parts for !). At one point I did consider an engine swap to the EJ platform, but not having a welding machine or experience doing this sort of thing - I wasn’t sure if it would be worth it after speaking to a few people here in Cape Town considering all the bits that would need to change (speaking under correction).

I bought the Move with the block and gearbox still in the car, but with head removed and all the other bits in the trunk. They were selling “as is” ( or “voetstoots” - which is a Dutch phrase that literally meant “testing something by shoving it with one’s foot” ) claiming that the head gasket blew - which I actually did not see any signs of (pictures will follow), but did note that all three pistons had slight marks where the intake valves had hit.

So I hooked up the battery and cranked the engine. Everything sounded great (like a sewing machine) and there was no play on any of the pistons while at TDC. I figured that with all the bits there - all I had to do was redo the head and put her back together; even with everything being covered in oil (which I suspect was from the perished sealing washer on the distributor or just a leaking valve cover perhaps) I did see it would be a big job to clean it all up, but relatively straight forward to do. But I can only think that with everything covered in oil I had missed the accumulation of oil on the exhaust (normalized deviation), that sits right under the clutch / mating surface for the engine and gearbox - yes - that’s right - it needs a new rear main seal. I only noticed this at home after towing it all the way with the A-Frame from Worcester to Cape Town (80KM). Note my kid having a good look at the folks that sold the car - her intuition seems rather strong!

And this is good time probably to indicate that the purpose of the buy was to (eventually) have a second run around, but also for me to rebuild that is simple and straight forward. That way it will keep me entertained while being at home and up skill myself on the mechanical side - I have a 10month old, so my outings are pretty limited these days No longer can I take out the KTM690 for a weekend with the boys to our backyard playground - Cederberg.

So having a KTM in the garage (Yes, the KTM still runs, and yes, I still have it. ), I have paid my school fees of letting someone else do the job. Hence I have bought the tools over the years to do this all myself. Save some money, do it right, but also to help myself if I get stuck in the rockies.

I really would appreciate any help that you guys can give me with the rebuild - this car is bringing people all over the world together! I had seen parts for the car online, but shipping was verrry expensive to say the least. I remembered that at a previous shop, I had worked with a great guy from Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia. I had reached out and asked if he could maybe do shipping at a better rate for me. He asked “What if I hand deliver it to you? I am coming to Cape Town in November.” - Ha! Needless to say I am very grateful and excited to see him (first time that we will meet in person) and to have a way forward with this project.

[Butch_Butcher]

The o-rings placed at the distributor’s end periodically become brittle. I would first renew it, if faulty, and the valve cover gasket, before outright condemning the rear main bearing’s seal. Camshaft seals are also prone to getting brittle. The aluminum heads on these seem to absorb a great amount of heat.
The EJ’s heads have more surface area with which to disperse a greater amount of heat. From what I’ve read here, converting from ED to EJ requires no welding and is otherwise straightforward.
Both engines have their advantages and disadvantages, the ED series being more simple and having a simpler engine management system. I find the low-end torque on these to be greater. These also still use a distributor cap and rotor and these engines are also insensitive to what sparkplug types are installed. I presently run somewhat crudely-machined BOSCH plugs made in Russia of which I bought cheap from Amazon, while I was still doing business with them.
The EJs provide a better higher-end power curve and are much less prone to camshaft wear, hardly ever needing valve adjustment, if ever. Their engine management systems are extremely sensitive to sparkplug types. These engines can have their timing belts snap, without their valves touching their pistons, unlike the EDs which would have disastrous results, once their belts fail. The dents in your ED’s pistons are more than likely the result of improper timing belt alignment, probably due to having jumped a couple of teeth, because of improper belt tension.
That’s quite an unusual Halloween mask your lady’s wearing